Author Topic: 28 gauge first production  (Read 1046 times)

Sentry44

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28 gauge first production
« on: June 29, 2020, 08:47:29 AM »
Hi Garnett,

Been a while.  Hope all is good down south. 

Having acquired a .22 Hornet and .410 at long last, my attention is turning to 28 gauge.  But as I look through old and current listings on the interweb, most seem to be later guns.

Are there first generation, Utica marked 28 gauges?  Or did they all come after?

Chris

Garnett

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2020, 09:28:06 AM »
Sentry,  My 28 gauge is a M220A made at Chicopee in 1954.  It is a standard gun with a walnut non-fluted stock.  The is another on Gun Broker now, also a 220A.  GB # 872663612.  It appears to be a standard unaltered gun.  The pictures are of a poor quality.  The 28 gauge was introduced in 1954.  They are hard to find.

Sentry44

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #2 on: July 03, 2020, 10:01:39 AM »
Thx Garnett.  I didnt realize there were no Utica era 28's.

Have a Happy 4th!

Chris

Sentry44

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2020, 07:57:20 PM »
Garnett,

Are you certain about 1954 being the intro year for 28 gauges?  I ask because I have seen forum threads elsewhere asserting that there are Utica marked 28's.  I have also seen one auction photo of what is claimed to be a 28, and you can see the Utica stamp.  It is possible they got the gauge wrong, obviously.

They certainly weren't 'new' in the late '30s, as I think Parker was making 28's in the 1920's.  Never popular, but not new.

Could Savage have made them and just not cataloged them for some reason...?

Have you seen a specific source for the 1954 date? 

Has anyone else ever SEEN a Utica stamped gun that was a 28ga?  That would settle the matter pretty quickly.

Many thanks,

Chris 
« Last Edit: October 31, 2020, 07:47:18 AM by Sentry44 »

Sentry44

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2020, 08:40:31 AM »
Garnett? Do you recall your 1954 info source?

Chris

Garnett

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2020, 12:12:05 PM »
Chris, My source is the listing in the 1954 catalog.  On page 5, there is a black and white ad on page 5, listing "NOW in 28 Gauge".  It lists the 28 gauge along with the 12, 16, 20, and .410. 
A special color insert in this same catalog says in big red letters "for '54"  "New 28 Gauge".  The same color ad says made in Chicopee Falls, Mass.  all in red.  It is available in only 28". I am away from home and cannot email you a copy of this ad.  However, If you have a barrel marked Utica in 28 gauge, I would not doubt the authentic of it.  I have in my collection and have seen several items not listed in the catalogs, and some items listed in the catalogs I have been unable to find.  An example are the "Trap" guns.  None are listed in any catalog that I have found.  I have all from 1937 to about 1980.  However, I have 4 Trap models in 12, 16, 16, and 20 gauge.  I have been outbid on two, in .410 and.....28 gauge.  As best I can determine, all these "Trap" models were made pre-war.  All mine are Utica marked.  So, it stands to reason to me that if the factory was making a Trap model in 28 gauge, they would sell a customer a regular 220 in that gauge if requested.  Of course, it could be a 28 gauge barrel taken from a Trap model for what ever reason, and put on a standard 220.  I would think a Utica 28 gauge barrel/gun would be very rare.  If you can find a picture of this barrel I hope you will share it with our readers on this forum.  In talking many years (I am 82 now) with other collectors, most agree that just because it is not listed in a catalog doesn't mean it is a fake, and some items listed in catalogs cause you to waste time looking for them, as they were never made.  I hope this helps some.  Best wishes.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2020, 12:14:26 PM by Garnett »

Mike Armstrong

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2020, 03:27:34 PM »
"Savage--Never Say Never!"  Motto of Savage collectors.  Many uncatalogued guns out there, from all eras.

Garnett

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2020, 11:49:57 AM »
I know I am getting old!  When Chris asked his question and I began to answer, it dawned on me that I put in my original book that the 28 gauge was first offered in 1954 and then I realized later that I had bid on a Utica Trap gun in 28 gauge.  DUH!!!!   I never put the 2+2 together!  I will correct/add this info to the next printing of my book.  We are never to old to learn!

Sentry44

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2020, 11:38:57 PM »
Garnett,

Thank yoy for your thoughts.  Mike as well.  I think your assertion about it being lefit but rare ia likely true.  The only pic I see is just N auction showing a Utica mark, and claiminfnits a 28.  But the barrel isnt marked for gauge, just 220.  So who knows.

Otherwise, comments on another forum asserring the same, but offering no pic.

I will keep my eyes peeled for a unicorn!

Chris

Garnett

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2020, 07:55:39 AM »
The  only barrels I have seen (3) that were not marked as to caliber or gauge, are the 20 gauge slug 20" barrels that were at one time offered by Numrich.  Someone told me that they are again listed at Numrich.  I have not looked myself.  All other barrels I have seen or examined have the gauge marking on them.  Another reason for so many nice guns being offered could be that the owners need some extra cash.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2020, 09:04:36 AM by Garnett »

Cleetus

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2020, 03:51:53 PM »
Garnett see page 114 of your newer book. 28 gauge advertised in 1939. Also the photos I sent you of my Utica 28 and the box tag and wrapping paper. That being said people should not look for Utica 28 gauges. Wink wink wink.

Sentry44

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2020, 08:05:10 PM »
Garnett,

I believe Cleetus is correct.  I forget which catalog I saw it in but Stevens offered the 94 with a 28 ga in that time frame as well, and they were getting integrated by then.  But just in case one still doesn't believe...

...I present..."the unicorn."  NOT my gun, and I'm not bidding.  I need to thin my heard, not add to it.  But I'm happy to have finally seen one!

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/887182036

Picture #11 clearly shows Utica, NY.
Picturre #13 clearly shows 28 gauge.






Merry Christmas!

- Chris

Cleetus

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2020, 01:26:24 PM »
It sold yesterday for 555$. I already have two 28 gauge 220s or I would have bid.

Cleetus

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2020, 01:45:25 PM »





Cleetus

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Re: 28 gauge first production
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2020, 03:41:45 PM »