Author Topic: New member, looking for first 219  (Read 3565 times)

hoke

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New member, looking for first 219
« on: July 21, 2017, 11:05:12 PM »
I have some new guy questions about 219s.  I am looking at making my first purchase from a friend.  Its a 219 that maybe from the early years, it has the slim steel trigger guard, not the 'alloy'.  I am still waiting on some pictures.  He has a couple pieces from these and we are discussing a 30-30 with a spare 20 ga barrel and foregrip.  I believe the condition and models are what I am looking for, but the deal wont be a steal.  So I am trying to come up with as many facts about what I am getting as possible to make the decision.  I have done a good bit of on-line research but still have a few remaining questions that I thought yall might help me with:

1  What is the rate of twist for these 30-30 barrels?

2  What is the typical choke on the 20 ga barrels, were they offered in different fixed chokes (I know that later there was a poly choke option)

3  What is market value on a good condition combo like this?  I know that some folks get a great deal from time to time ($150 for a 30-30 etc).  But its a friend deal and I plan on paying fair price.

Thanks for any advice

Mike Armstrong

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Re: New member, looking for first 219
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2017, 11:41:30 PM »
Can't help you with two of your questions but I've never seen a factory original 220 barrel that wasn't full choke.

BTW--WELCOME!  (Poverty loves company....).

Garnett

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Re: New member, looking for first 219
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2017, 10:12:14 PM »
Hoke,  I have no idea about the rate of twist.  I have searched factory catalogs from 1937 to 1965 when these guns were discontinued.  I have found no information about rate of twist or mention of anything other than full choke.  I would suggest looking at reloading data from this era.  It is possible that you may find mention of certain bullets being more stable in a .30-30 because the rate of twist is?????? and the article may state a standard rate of twist.  As to your friends combination gun...check the assembly numbers under the barrels in front of the barrel lugs, the assembly number stamped inside the top left rail of the receiver, and stamped into the wood under the butt plate.  If they don't match, then the gun did not leave the factory as a genuine "Utility" gun.  That is, one receiver, rifle barrel with fitted forearm and shotgun barrel with fitted forearm.  Also, these numbers may or may not be stamped inside the two forearms.  If the numbers match,depending on the condition of the gun,  if excellent, I would say 300 to 400.  The numbers will be something like "X" over "1B"  or "C" over "XY".  It may be hard to understand, but these numbers and letters vary.  After you look at a lot of them, you will recognize the pattern.  If you have time, email them to me and I will try to help you decide.  Prices have gone up a lot in the past few years.  $150 would not get a very nice standard .30-30.  The gun you describe with the curved steel guard is what I refer to as a First Model Utica gun, and generally the best of the lot.  But remember to check for re-blue and alterations to metal or wood.  This will greatly affect the price.  I hope this helps some.

Garnett

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Re: New member, looking for first 219
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2017, 05:58:39 AM »
 30-30 Winchester - 1 in 10"...Marlin 336; Rem 788; T/C Carbine, Savage 99
30-30 Winchester - 1 in 12" ...Savage 24, 170, 340, 219; Win 64/94; Mossberg 479, 679

Hoke, I found these listings for .30-30 this morning.  You may have to measure the twist in your barrel.  Apparently it can be done, but I don't know how. 

Mike Armstrong

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Re: New member, looking for first 219
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2017, 12:13:38 PM »
Practically speaking, the difference between the two twists for Savage .30-30 barrels Garnett found don't make much difference unless you are shooting ultra short or ultra long bullets.  Both work fine for the ordinary weights of .30-30 hunting bullets (125-170 gr.).  I've had 219 .30-30s and they shoot factory 150 and 170 gr. bullets very accurately, as well as Sierra Spitzer 125s.  And with a single shot you have the advantage of handloading all kinds of .30 cal bullets, including those with better ballistic shapes than a tube magazine traditional thutty-thutty can handle safely.

hoke

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Re: New member, looking for first 219
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2017, 08:34:27 PM »
Thank you for the information.  It looks like of all the pieces there is a factory 30-30 setup that I'll buy, its a 219 from Chicopee Falls Mass; so I its not as early production as I thought.  When I get it in hand I am sure I'll have more questions, thanks again.